Gateway in two networks (Helium and TTN)

Data-only hotspots on Helium can be connected to multiple LoRaWAN networks when DIY. I have some running myself.

How does it stay within legal Tx limits?

Not, when downlink load is high. But this is not relevant for the discussion.

Of course it’s relevant.

Both breaking the law, and dropping downlinks assigned to that gateway by the network server are serious issues.

At present there’s no solution that solves both problems, because nobody has yet implemented a “Hey, you willing to do this? Sorry, not right now, try somebody else” scheme between network servers and gateways, as would be required to share gateways.

Even “packet broker”, which sounds like it should do that, turns out to not (at least in the TTN interface) to make any effort to solve the downlink airtime exhaustion / scheduling conflict problem whatsoever.

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Coming up with this topic in this thread is similar to hijacking a topic. I would have chosen to start a new thread. Although this topic was discussed extensively before.

Then why did you claim it was possible, especially if you are aware of previous discussion explaining why it isn’t?

You can’t yourself post misinformation and then complain about the responses which explain why it doesn’t really work right.

Technically it is possible. So that is not misinformation. Is it legal? As long as the gateway stays within airtime allocations it is. Is there a process that will guarantee the gateway stays legal? No. Is it desirable? Not given the potential issues. Can anyone with sufficient knowledge make it happen? Yes, most definitely.

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Not really, no - you forget that legality is only part of the problem.

The other problem is downlink scheduling conflict.

That can only be solved by enhancing network servers with an algorithm that puts out requests, and if the original is declined, re-issues it to another candidate gateway.

At present, NACK on tx requests is theoretically reported, but I don’t believe anyone has a “well then we’ll try elsewhere” scheme.

The switch to a longer RX1 interval should make this possible to implement (for current packet forwarders with a queue which permits advance rather than last minute pushing of TX requests), but it hasn’t been done.

Fortunately re-allocation would (in combination with gateways tracking their own airtime) solve both schedule conflict and legality problems.

I’m not ignorant and as author of one of the packet forwarders am well aware of the issue. That is why I state it is not desirable and I try to discourage everyone attempting to do so. However if one accepts the potential downsides caused by downlink packet loss (which might happen anyway in an RF environment) and the potential backlash from fellow LoRaWAN users it is still possible.

Problem is the gateway deployer might accept risk of loss and other downsides but other community users dont get to decide and they also see downlinks for the ‘foreign network’ causing the GW to miss uplinks whilst handling them creating an artificially high level of packet loss over and above what might be expected just due to RF environment or other issues - can even be viewed as a mini DoS :frowning: Community users may be happy with a GW 5km away, then suddenly find a shared GW is placed say 500m away and esp with ADR they then find they are subject to increased losses…

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The problems are well known and beaten to dead on this forum by now. As this isn’t going anywhere I’ll close the topic right now.

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